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Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

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Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby idiotSavant » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:43 am

First recording of this piece. I've been transcribing and mixing it for about three weeks now. Always a favorite.

This piece is sometimes played with a violin solo for the melody. I took the approach used by Stokowski in his recording from the early 50's, which was how it was originally arranged for orchestra by Rachmaninov, with the melody being played by 16 violins en masse.

Let me know what you think!

https://soundcloud.com/tensivity/rachmaninov-vocalise-appassionata-solo-valhalla-5-31-14
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby fabiolcati » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:42 pm

Let me know what you think!

I think that sometimes it sounds like a recording from the Stokowski era.
But you have done such a great job!
And WalhallaRoom is really great — and inexpensive.
I often say that some of these midi performances can stand in quality
alongside with many actual recorded ones (I mean from a expression standpoint,
not sonically).
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby idiotSavant » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:26 pm

fabiolcati wrote:I often say that some of these midi performances can stand in quality
alongside with many actual recorded ones (I mean from a expression standpoint,
not sonically).


Fabio, it's interesting that you say that. My ears are still evolving to hear the subtle sonic quality differences between the reference recordings I use and the recordings I make. On the other hand, I can hear a huge gap in terms of expressiveness between "real" human players and my VSL instrumentalists.

Thanks as always for the input!
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby fabiolcati » Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:54 pm

On the other hand, I can hear a huge gap in terms of expressiveness between "real" human players and my VSL instrumentalists.

Of course you're right.
I'm speaking in terms of quality of the reading.
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby Migot » Mon Jun 02, 2014 10:57 pm

Michael,

...Great work !

Just wondering why you do not get MIRx ?
it really worth... Just a wonderful feature.

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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby idiotSavant » Mon Jun 02, 2014 11:20 pm

Alain, thanks so much!

I tried MIRx. I own only the Studios and Sound Stages Room Packs for MIRPro and so I only have the Teldex Studio MIRx versions available. I wasn't overly impressed by the sound.

Also, my workflow is to use multiple Vienna Ensemble instances (I use one for Violins I, one for Violins II, one for Viola etc.) and these can't appear in the same MIRPro venue together unless I use MIRPro as a VST plug-in.

Is there a sound pack that you like best? I might try it out since there's a sale going on. The Vienna Konzerthaus Grosser Saal is 67 Euros.
Michael

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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby Yves » Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:04 pm

Idiot savant, have you ever had a look on Vocaloid Prima?
this virtual singer would shine with such melody...

this is a long time that I have not used it, but your song made me recall of it.
Vocaloid Prima can sing sentences, but it shines especially when it sing simple vocals.

please find attached two very old compositions I made with Notion and Vocaloid (notion used the vst plugin of vocaloid for writing, but I then render notion and vocaloid separately, to be able to use Vocaloid 3 Superior quality for better phrasing/slured speech).

have a link to my archive songs with a vocalise rendition with Vocaloid Prima:
https://soundcloud.com/yves-berranger/vogue

and here is the link with a singing poem from Shel Silverstein (this is an extract from a series of poem for sopranos, here in Where sidewalks ends, we have a duet of sopranos):
https://soundcloud.com/yves-berranger/sidewalk

you would hear here, that the words are quite difficult to understand... :(

I am still looking to improvment on Vocaloid for better English speaking rendition...

:)
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby saintdufus » Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:25 pm

Very interesting and enjoyable rendition of this classic theme. It's a bit different from the versions I've heard--somehow your woodwinds are more pronounced perhaps, and your strings more demarcated.

In some places it sounds you've used tempo rubato (a Rachmaninov hallmark)...did you do that by changing the number of beats per minute on certain measures, or some other way?

Nice dynamics and blending of instruments.
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby idiotSavant » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:45 am

Yves wrote:Idiot savant, have you ever had a look on Vocaloid Prima?
this virtual singer would shine with such melody...

Yves, thanks, I've been thinking about getting into vocal synthesis. Unfortunately, Vocaloid Prima is a windows-only program and I'm on Mac. :(

My friend Philippe Bayac on the VSL Board uses Requiem Pro, very nice program but expensive. Have you seen it?

Check out one of his pieces here:

https://soundcloud.com/philippe-baylac/first-test-choral-bach-vsl
Last edited by idiotSavant on Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rachmaninov - Vocalise - ValhallaRoom Reverb

Postby idiotSavant » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:47 am

saintdufus wrote:Very interesting and enjoyable rendition of this classic theme. It's a bit different from the versions I've heard--somehow your woodwinds are more pronounced perhaps, and your strings more demarcated.

In some places it sounds you've used tempo rubato (a Rachmaninov hallmark)...did you do that by changing the number of beats per minute on certain measures, or some other way?

Nice dynamics and blending of instruments.

Saint, thanks for the feedback!

I used a lot of tempo changes and ritando and accelerando to produce the tempo effects that i wanted in this recording. I used to try to use the ntempo feature but could never get it to work properly. It's broken, apparently, and is supposed to be fixed with the next release.

I sometimes also use fermata and tenuto and breath markings. They take a little getting used to but work pretty well in Notion.
Michael

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