NOTION Music Forum

Now the rit.'s and other tempo markings in the score can't be marked, deleted, edited or anything...

make sure your not in performance mode; you can't edit when this is the case. Other than that, I recommend contacting tech support, they do a great job.

mrarnesen wrote:What kind of software is this?

Many of us prefer to work with Notion because it has an attractive combination of features and an excellent workflow. An intuitive user interface makes the learning curve considerably less steeper than what we are used to from Notion's competitors -- but still there are things to be learnt. For learning purposes the manual is very helpful, as well as the excellent tech support. Nothing is perfect - neither Notion nor any other pieces of music software. To be honest, I find it easier to be taken by frustration when working with the two big players in the notation industry. In general, I think it would be great if we avoid sharing our frustration immediately in the forum, with comments like the one quoted above, which is only a rhetorical addendum that has nothing to do with the real question -- which in this case is a very basic one. If we use the forum mainly as an outlet for immediate frustration, potential Notion purchasers will easily be scared away form the software, which means less turnover, which means slower development of the software -- and this runs counter to our common interests as Notion users.

Best wishes,
Otto

ottomc wrote:

mrarnesen wrote:What kind of software is this?

Many of us prefer to work with Notion because it has an attractive combination of features and an excellent workflow. An intuitive user interface makes the learning curve considerably less steeper than what we are used to from Notion's competitors -- but still there are things to be learnt. For learning purposes the manual is very helpful, as well as the excellent tech support. Nothing is perfect - neither Notion nor any other pieces of music software. To be honest, I find it easier to be taken by frustration when working with the two big players in the notation industry. In general, I think it would be great if we avoid sharing our frustration immediately in the forum, with comments like the one quoted above, which is only a rhetorical addendum that has nothing to do with the real question -- which in this case is a very basic one. If we use the forum mainly as an outlet for immediate frustration, potential Notion purchasers will easily be scared away form the software, which means less turnover, which means slower development of the software -- and this runs counter to our common interests as Notion users.

Best wishes,
Otto

Well, I guess you are right. But have you felt the frustration after spending hours of hours to make a score, and in the end you barely can't use it? But OK, next time I get frustrated I'll go for a walk

Oh yes, Frustration is the surname of all music software -- Enthusiasm being the first name, though. I have been terribly frustrated lots of times, also when working with Notion, which needs a number of bug fixes and added features in the notation department, as several users have made explicit in the forum. Sometimes too explicit, perhaps. Understandably so, if you have been working on a score for a long time and suddenly gets stuck. Thus, my own reaction to your comment was a kind of second level frustration -- the result of my reading quite a few harsh comments in the forum over the last weeks (not all of them justified, IMHO). I was frustrated over frustration, in other words.

Anyway, I hope my frustration did not make my own post too harsh. I also need to go for a walk form time to time, I guess

ottomc wrote:Oh yes, Frustration is the surname of all music software -- Enthusiasm being the first name, though. I have been terribly frustrated lots of times, also when working with Notion, which needs a number of bug fixes and added features in the notation department, as several users have made explicit in the forum. Sometimes too explicit, perhaps. Understandably so, if you have been working on a score for a long time and suddenly gets stuck. Thus, my own reaction to your comment was a kind of second level frustration -- the result of my reading quite a few harsh comments in the forum over the last weeks (not all of them justified, IMHO). I was frustrated over frustration, in other words.

Anyway, I hope my frustration did not make my own post too harsh. I also need to go for a walk form time to time, I guess

Well said, Otto! Thanks for your civil, well-written contributions to the forum.

Best wishes,
Thorrild

mrarnesen wrote:Now the rit.'s and other tempo markings in the score can't be marked, deleted, edited or anything...

This is bug, i have this problem if i create or delete (i dont remember now) measure after rit. or acc. sign. And plus acc. and rit. sign move somewhere away. The solution for this is first use reshereal marks where you want put acc. and rit. and if you finish score, add it at last thing.

What version of notion you use? I use N3.

thorrild wrote:Well said, Otto! Thanks for your civil, well-written contributions to the forum.

Thank you, thorrild, and the same to you. It is a pleasure to read your accommodating posts in the forum

Best regards,
Otto

ottomc wrote:Oh yes, Frustration is the surname of all music software -- Enthusiasm being the first name, though. I have been terribly frustrated lots of times, also when working with Notion, which needs a number of bug fixes and added features in the notation department, as several users have made explicit in the forum. Sometimes too explicit, perhaps. Understandably so, if you have been working on a score for a long time and suddenly gets stuck. Thus, my own reaction to your comment was a kind of second level frustration -- the result of my reading quite a few harsh comments in the forum over the last weeks (not all of them justified, IMHO). I was frustrated over frustration, in other words.

Anyway, I hope my frustration did not make my own post too harsh. I also need to go for a walk form time to time, I guess

I also share your enthusiasm about Notion. The first phase, composing, arranging etc is so great with Notion. And i don't wanna use any other software for this part. I've tried various notation software and Notion is the number one for doing this. But the next phase is to make good prints: A full score and/or vocal score, and instrument parts. And then it has to become more flexible when it comes to layout, engraving rules, hiding/showing, real dynamic parts etc. There's almost nothing in Sibelius that can't be dragged or adjusted in various ways.

Have we got any hints from Notion that they are reading our requests?

mrarnesen wrote:

ottomc wrote:Oh yes, Frustration is the surname of all music software -- Enthusiasm being the first name, though. I have been terribly frustrated lots of times, also when working with Notion, which needs a number of bug fixes and added features in the notation department, as several users have made explicit in the forum. Sometimes too explicit, perhaps. Understandably so, if you have been working on a score for a long time and suddenly gets stuck. Thus, my own reaction to your comment was a kind of second level frustration -- the result of my reading quite a few harsh comments in the forum over the last weeks (not all of them justified, IMHO). I was frustrated over frustration, in other words.

Anyway, I hope my frustration did not make my own post too harsh. I also need to go for a walk form time to time, I guess

I also share your enthusiasm about Notion. The first phase, composing, arranging etc is so great with Notion. And i don't wanna use any other software for this part. I've tried various notation software and Notion is the number one for doing this. But the next phase is to make good prints: A full score and/or vocal score, and instrument parts. And then it has to become more flexible when it comes to layout, engraving rules, hiding/showing, real dynamic parts etc. There's almost nothing in Sibelius that can't be dragged or adjusted in various ways.

You have answered your own questions and provided the necessary solution!

(1) Do the "first phase" of your composing in NOTION 4 . . .

(2) Do the "second phase" of your composing in Sibelius 7 (Avid), since as you noted it has all the required advanced support and capabilities for the apparently exacting and demanding print that your work requires . . .

mrarnesen wrote:Have we got any hints from Notion that they are reading our requests?

This is insulting and to continue doing it over and over is whining, which makes it frustrating . . .

Find a way to be happy!

THOUGHTS

I am certain that the folks at Notion Music are well aware of everything, as is everyone else for the most part, and the fact of the matter is that excelling in one aspect often requires doing a bit of compromising on other aspects, which is fine with me and is the logical and practical way to provide sensible solutions for specific digital music production needs . . .

Another fact in the digital music production universe is that doing professional work requires more than one application, where for those folk who do everything themselves, NOTION 4 is an excellent foundation but it needs to be augmented with a Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) application like Digital Performer 8 (MOTU) or Logic Pro 9 (Apple) on the Mac . . .

And the complete digital music production system needs to include several sets of VSTi virtual instruments and corresponding sampled sound libraries, like the IK Multimedia VSTi virtual instruments (which currently are 32-bit only but eventually will be 64-bit), Addictive Drums and Addictive Keys (XLN Audio), Kontakt 5 (Native Instruments), MachFive 3 (MOTU), and additional sampled sounds specialty libraries provided by companies like Bolder Sounds and Orange Tree Software who focus on specific instruments that are not so common or whatever . . .

And there are other VSTi virtual instruments and associated sampled sound libraries, of course . . .

The complete digital music production system also needs a deep and rich set of effects and signal processing plug-ins, which includes the T-RackS CS Grand (IK Multimedia) components, ARC System 2 (IK Multimedia) for calibrating a full-range studio monitor system, several of the FabFilter Software Instruments and Wave Arts effects and signal processing plug-ins, and so forth and so on . . .

Additionally, one needs to have a calibrated full-range studio monitor system which has "big and heavy" loudspeakers and can be calibrated to have a full-range flat equal loudness curve at 85 dB SPL, which is the ideal listening level when doing mixing and mastering . . .

And it is necessary to have some real instruments, at least if one plays real instruments, and some microphones and a recording studio for recording the real instruments and singing, which in turn requires an external digital audio interface like the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid to get the analog real instruments and microphones digitized, as well as to provide a MIDI interface for the computer so that it can interact with real MIDI instruments, although more recently there are USB MIDI products, except that some MIDI synthesizers use regular MIDI cables and ports, hence the need the standard type of MIDI interface, cables, and so forth . . .

Once you understand it, everything works, and it works very accurately, reliably, and nicely, but as noted it is not a single application or program, and while in Utopia it might be wonderful to dream of a single application that does everything, it is not practical in the real world . . .

And on top of all the stuff I already listed, a complete digital music production system needs to include Reason 6.5 (Propellerhead Software) and to be ReWire 2 (Propellerhead Software) ready, willing, and able, because the general idea for a complete digital music production system is that it be complete in every respect, and one of the excellent aspects of NOTION 4 is that it can sent External MIDI commands and instructions based on music notation to Reason 6.5 for purpose of controlling and playing Reason 6.5 instruments via a combination of MIDI and ReWire 2, while at the same NOTION 4 is controlling and playing VSTi virtual instruments and sending its generated audio to Digital Performer 8, which in this scenario is the ReWIre 2 host controller, which in the grand scheme of everything makes all the virtual instruments available to augment whichever real instruments and vocals you decide to play and sing, where NOTION 4 is the foundation which makes all this both possible and practical, which is fabulous . . .

Fabulous!

P. S. MusicXML is a technology that the folks who do Finale created; Sibelius 7 supports MusicXML; and NOTION 4 includes expanded MusicXML support, which I think is an important clue with respect to the practical solution to your advanced printing needs, especially since both Finale and Sibelius have competitive crossgrades (approximately $150 [US] each) for which NOTION 3 and NOTION 4 are qualifying products . . .

And since I think that graphic design and typography are fascinating, I devoted a bit of attention to exploring Sibelius 7 and its advanced layout and printing capabilities for music notation, with the result that I am comfortable recommending Sibelius 7 for advanced music notation printing, and one way to put this into perspective is to consider Word (Microsoft) and Pages (Apple) for a moment . . .

Word and Pages are excellent programs for writing stuff, and they include the ability to do a bit of graphic design work, but neither of them does what Adobe Photoshop does in the graphic design arena, so if you have advanced graphic design needs, then get Adobe Photoshop to augment Word or Pages, which is the practical solution and is the same conceptually as using Sibelius 7 to augment NOTION 4 when you have advanced sheet music printing needs and requirements, really . . .

Really!