NOTION Music Forum

I'm evaluating the demo version. Everything was fine, but now, when I hit play, the cursor moves without the music starting and the music then starts on the second beat, and comes in harshly as if there is a glitch. Throughout the entire score, the cursor is one beat ahead. This happens in all scores. Is this a bug or have I set something wrong?

killatree wrote:I'm evaluating the demo version. Everything was fine, but now, when I hit play, the cursor moves without the music starting and the music then starts on the second beat, and comes in harshly as if there is a glitch. Throughout the entire score, the cursor is one beat ahead. This happens in all scores. Is this a bug or have I set something wrong?

The scenario you described is most indicative of a problem with what in digital music production is called "latency", and there are solutions, some of which are trivial but others of which are not so trivial . . .

OVERVIEW

One of the key aspects of digital music production is the fact that it takes the computer a bit of time to do all the processing required to generate audio, and this time can range from negligible to intolerable . . .

The length of time from (a) a request for audio to (b) the arrival of the generated audio is called "latency", with the processing required to generate the audio accounting generally for what happens between (a) and (b), where in this instance "processing" includes hard drive activities (which are the slowest and occur typically in milliseconds), memory activities, and Central Processing Unit (CPU) activities, although "CPU" is an older term, but so what . . .

So what!

Yet another key bit of information is that no matter how fast a computer happens to be, it is possible to overwhelm the computer with requests for digital music production activities, and one of the consequences of this fact is that digital musicians devote a bit of focus to determining the best ways to configure their computers to minimize latency and its artifacts . . .

As it applies to NOTION 3, it is useful to consider the two supported operating system platforms for a moment (Mac OS X and Windows) . . .

Apple computers are designed as complete systems by one company, and everything is controlled ruthlessly, which in a practical way maps to Apple having and exercising the ability to do everything (hardware, firmware, and software), which in the grand scheme of everything for digital music production, as well as other types of what generally is called "multimedia", maps to Apple computers being designed specifically to handle the work of digital music production with minimal latency problems, which is one of the reasons that doing digital music production on an Apple computer is as easy as possible, because stuff works without requiring a lot of configuring and tinkering . . .

One the other hand, this also can happen on a Windows machine, but since Microsoft does not do hardware and firmware, the way it works is that everything depends primarily on the specific hardware and firmware of the machine one selects for running Windows, where with fast hardware and firmware everything is fine, but when the hardware and firmware are not so fast, there are problems . . .

This is one of the reasons that Apple computers appear to cost more than Windows machines, where what happens is that Apple uses higher quality hardware and firmware, which costs more, but in many instances the folks who design and build Windows machines use lower quality hardware and firmware, which costs less . . .

Nevertheless, with the correct hardware and firmware, a Windows machine can be just as capable and fast as an Apple computer, and when this happens what one discovers is that the cost differences are negligible and in some instances an Apple computer will cost less, which is a good way to put the cost of computers and operating systems into perspective when one is doing digital music production . . .

However, this is just one aspect, and there are other aspects . . .

I do everything here in the sound isolation studio with a 2.8-GHz 8-core Mac Pro which has a very fast RAID (0) hard drive array, which in some respects is a bit frightening, but so what . . .

So what!

And it is very easy to configure the machine so that it has huge latency problems, which happens when the "lookahead" buffers are set too high, with the solution being not to do it, really . . .

Really!

Mac OS X CoreAudio is highly optimized so that the hardware, firmware, and operating system do everything as efficiently and optimally as possible, but I like to augment everything with a MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid audio interface, which moves some of the digital music production work from the Mac Pro to the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid audio interface, although the primary uses for the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid are (a) to do analog-to-digital conversion and (b) to act as a MIDI interface . . .

If you do not want to mess with any of this stuff, then one strategy is to get a new Apple computer and a MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid audio interface, where what happens is that you connect the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid audio interface to the Apple computer using a FireWire cable, and then after a few minutes of setting initial parameters, everything works and you can focus on doing digital music production without needing to know a bunch of technical stuff, at least until you become so productive that you need to consider the constraints imposed by NOTION 3 running as a 32-bit application, which is another matter for which there are solutions . . .

Regardless of whether your are using an Apple computer or a Windows machine, sooner or later, you will need to understand at least something about all this stuff, but if you are using an Apple computer, then you can refer to several of my topics in this FORUM for strategies that provide practical solutions for all the complex stuff, which tends to be an excellent way to avoid needing to know a bunch of mind-boggling technical stuff . . .

For reference, the reason that I have a 2.8-GHz 8-core Mac Pro is that sometime circa 2009 all the digital music production stuff I was doing completely and totally overwhelmed the iMac G5 (PPC) computer I was using at the time, which was before I discovered NOTION 3 and VSTi virtual instruments, so it was more a matter of VST effects plug-ins and having a lot of tracks in Digital Performer (MOTU) that overwhelmed the iMac G5 (PPC) computer, but so what . . .

So what!

And it is virtually trivial to overwhelm the 2.8-GHz 8-core Mac Pro here in the sound isolation studio, so part of the strategy here in the sound isolation studio involves devising practical solutions which do not map to overwhelming everything, which I will explain in more detail in the second part of this technical information extravaganza, since the Notion Music FORUM has a 10,000 characters per post limit, and it does not take me very long to write 10,000 characters, really . . .

Really!

P. S. This is the end of Part 1, and it continues in Part 2 . . .

Setting the various parameters involved with latency is very important, regardless of the relative speed of the computer, and the exact values for the various parameters depend on the specific computer, so there is no universally correct set of values . . .

For the 2.8-GHz 8-core Mac Pro here in the sound isolation studio, I leave the key NOTION 3 parameter at the factory default value, which specifically has the Audio Buffer Size set to 256 samples, because if I increase it, then the problem you described is quite likely to occur . . .



Similarly, I keep the buffering in Digital Performer 7.24 (MOTU) small, where I set the Buffer Size to 1024; Host Buffer Multiplier to 2; and Work Priority to High, which works nicely . . .



[NOTE: If you are observant, you will observe that the settings for NOTION 3 have the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid selected as the output device, but "Built-in" audio is set for the output device in Digital Performer 7.24, and this is done because I have the system configured so that I can switch back and forth from using CoreAudio (a.k.a., "Built-in") to the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid, which is done in part because the Melodyne Editor (Celemony) requires CoreAudio, and I use the Melodyne Editor. And when I am not doing ReWire from NOTION 3 to Digital Performer 7.24, NOTION 3 tends to work better with CoreAudio, since (a) NOTION 3 uses a non-standard pair of output channels for its Master stereo output track and (b) I tend to forget how to set it correctly for use with the MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid . . . ]

In both instances (NOTION 3 and Digital Performer 7.24), these are low settings, and this works because the 2.8-GHz 8-core Mac Pro is a reasonably fast machine with highly optimized hardware and firmware, including fast internal hard drives, so the parameter settings for other machines probably will be different, although in some respects the Mac Pro here in the sound isolation studio is slower than a new iMac, with the exception of the memory and hard drive busses and all that stuff, which for all practical purposes is the only actual advantage of a Mac Pro as contrasted to an iMac, although being able to swap internal hard drives easily is very nice . . .

Yet another reality is that due to both NOTION 3 and Digital Performer 7.24 currently being 32-bit applications, the Mac Pro here in the sound isolation studio typically runs at approximately 15 percent of its capabilities, which maps to using the equivalent of around 100 percent of 1 of the 8 cores at any given time, although the work typically is spread over 2 or 3 of the 8 cores since there is a tiny bit of multiprocessing being done, all of which is due to the 32-bit application workspace limitation, as well as to multiprocessing and multitasking considerations, where as a general rule digital music production software tends to be single-threaded or whatever, which is the consequence of (a) some of the work being so time sensitive that it must be single-threaded and (b) multithreading, multicore programming, and parallel processing require software engineers to have vastly advanced skills and expertise, which makes such folks not so easy to find at the dawn of the early-21st century, but so what . . .

So what!

Another very important consideration involves the limitations of 32-bit application workspaces with respect to VST effects plug-ins and VSTi virtual instruments, where the high-level overview is that NOTION 3 can handle approximately 25 "heavy" VSTi virtual instruments in a single project or score, and the practical solution when you need more "heavy" VSTi virtual instruments is (a) to clone the original NOTION 3 score and (b) to use a set of cloned NOTION 3 scores while keeping everything synchronized, which when done correctly maps to the ability to have 500 to 1,000 "heavy" VSTi virtual instruments in a song, with a key part of the strategy being to record the NOTION 3 generated audio as soundbites in Digital Performer 7.24 via ReWire, with this basically being is the strategy where you construct a song in layers . . .

For reference, sometime in the future when NOTION 3 and Digital Performer are true 64-bit applications and all VST effects plug-ins and VSTi virtual instruments are true 64-bit components, which includes the sampled sound libraries being higher resolution, it will be easy to overwhelm state-of-the-art computers, although it might take a while to discover how to do this . . .

Explained another way, no matter how it is done, it is not so difficult to overwhelm a computer, so the key is to discover how to do a lot of stuff within the constraints and capabilities of the hardware, firmware, and software . . .

For example, if sometime in the future there are computers which are trillions of times faster than the fastest supercomputers on this planet today, someone will have the idea of putting each musician of a symphonic orchestra inside a "microphone megapod" which has inner walls that look a bit like the compound eye of honey bee, where each individual "eye" is a separate and independent microphone, which might map having one million microphones for each microphone megapod . . .

But instead of having just one symphonic orchestra, the same person would have the bright idea of having 1,000 symphonic orchestras, each with 1,000 musicians, and then what you have is 1,000 times 1,000, times 1 million tracks, which since the microphones might as well be stereo microphones, maps to needing a Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) application that can handle 1 trillion stereo tracks, and best wishes on setting the latency parameters for that system, where the reason for having 1,000 musicians per symphonic orchestra is that it requires 8 musicians to play the "sparkled" notes for what otherwise would be one instrument, which makes little if any sense until you discover how I use the term "sparkled", really. . .

Really!

SUMMARY

There are a few scenarios that fit the problem you described:

(1) Your computer is entirely too slow and outdated, in which case I recommend getting a new iMac (Apple), where the least expensive new iMac will be very nice, since you can add some memory from Other World Computing to make it nicer . . .

(2) You are using more than 25 "heavy" VSTi virtual instruments and some number of "heavy" VST effects plug-ins in your NOTION 3 score, in which case I refer you to my ongoing topic on "Notion 3, DISCO Songs, and Sparkles" in this FORUM, which will be helpful no matter which operating system you are using, although the focus specifically is on how to do a virtually absurd festival of advanced stuff with a Mac, where the "virtually absurd festival" refers to the general concept of having 1,000 instruments for a song, which actually is not so absurd as one might imagine, since fully "sparkling" an instrument requires 8 staves, hence if you divide 1,000 instruments by 8, then it is more in line with this being the number of staves required for a fully "sparkled" symphonic orchestra, or perhaps more correctly for 8 complete symphonic orchestras positioned in 8 locations within a spherical concert hall where you are sitting in a floating chair in the center of the sphere . . .

Notion 3, DISCO Songs, and Sparkles (Notion Music FORUM)

(3) You tinkered with the Audio Buffer Settings, in which case you set it too high or too low, so put it back to 256 samples . . .

With a bit more information about what you are doing, it will be possible to provide specific advice on what is happening and how to solve the problem, which is fabulous . . .

Fabulous!

P. S. This is Part 2, and there might be a Part 3, but it depends on how many cups of Massimo Zanetti Master Chef® coffee I enjoy, which for reference I make at the ratio of 1/2 cup of ground coffee to 12 ounces of water at the ideal brewing temperature of 200 degrees Fahrenheit, which works for me since I have the full array of what I call the "South American Coffee Achiever Gene Matrix™", even though I am not South American and have never visited South America, and as a bit of a warning for those folks who do not have the full array of the South American Coffee Achiever Matrix, consuming as little as one cup of coffee this strong could be a fatal endeavor, hence is strongly discouraged . . .

I probably will do something in this post, but first I need (a) to edit the previous two posts and (b) to drink more coffee, really . . .

Really!

P. S. This is the current version of "Tastes Like Anarchy" (The Surf Whammys), which among other things has a partially "sparkled" Celeste and a fully "sparkled" Shaker and Cowbell, where the latter is an audio pun, which is fabulous . . .

"Tastes Like Anarchy" (The Surf Whammys) -- Basic Rhythm Section -- MP3 (8.8MB, 301-kbps [VBR], approximately 3 minutes and 51 seconds)

Fabulous!

Mac jones wrote:Suggestion:

A sub forum for OCD musicians

Absolutely!

The important thing is to discover how one learns, and while in some respects I amextraordinarily smart, in other respects I am equally stupid, and what happens is that I get stuck on things which for other folks are a bit beyond abundantly obvious . . .

For example, when I decided to teach myself how to play lead guitar, I knew how to do three things:

(1) play electric bass . . .

(2) change electric guitar strings . . .

(3) identify the notes for lead guitar solos one note at a time by slowing the turntable speed and listening to the lead guitar solo over and over, which worked nicely since (a) I already knew how to play electric bass and (b) at half speed or slower, the notes of a lead guitar solo sound like electric bass notes, where curiously I used the reverse strategy to learn how to play electric bass, where instead of slowing a record I would play it at a faster speed, which made it sound like a lead guitar solo, although I did not make this observational leap until quite a while later, since I did not realize in an immediately conscious way that playing an electric bass part twice as fast is very similar to playing a lead guitar part twice as slow, which probably was due to the patterns being different, where electric bass is more focused on counterpoint, while lead guitar is more focused on melody, which I generally continue to view as being primarily separate and independent activities . . .

Counterpoint (wikipedia)

Melody (wikipedia)

Hence, for the first year or so, I spent half of the time changing guitar strings, where I would install a new set of strings, play a few chords for five minutes or so, and then repeat the process over and over, which mapped (a) to purchasing sets of strings by the case and (b) to becoming vastly proficient in changing guitar strings . . .

The other half of the time was devoted to identifying the notes for approximately 16 of my favorite lead guitar solos, which with a bit of practice I could play at a tempo of perhaps 10 BPM . . .

Then I had the required epiphany, which specifically was observing the fact that it was quite likely that every lead guitar solo recorded since the early days when Thomas Edison designed and built the first music recording machine was played by a lead guitarist who had at most four fingers and a thumb on each hand, although there is a least one exception to this rule, which I discovered several months ago and was a fellow who had an extra finger on one hand . . .

Connecting the dots and noting that I have four fingers and a thumb on each hand, it became obvious that all I needed to do was to discover how to play the notes of lead guitar solos faster, which mostly was a matter of practicing the same phrases over and over until they become automatic, where instead of being a set of individual notes, they became an entity or Gestalt, since it was obvious from studying the patterns in the 16 or so lead guitar solos I transcribed that there were not so many unique phrases for the genres that I like . . .

And then the rate of progress accelerated geometrically . . .

For reference, this is a photograph of one of the 3" by 5" note cards that I used when I transcribed "Come On (Let The Good Times Roll)" (The Jimi Hendrix Experience), which I transcribed in the late-1970s . . .



[NOTE: The part on the note card (see above) starts at approximately 1:24 in the YouTube music video and runs for approximately 10 seconds, and I practiced this 10 seconds of fantastic lead guitar over and over 20 thousand or so times before I could play it at full tempo, where the curious aspect is that it made it very easy to learn how to play Ace Frehley (KISS) and Jimmy Page (Led Zeppelin) lead guitar solos, since they do pretty much the same thing but with a few variations, where Ace Frehley occasionally spreads the standard "3-1-1-1-4-1" phrase differently by moving the notes on the high-pitch "b" string to the high-pitch "e" string and doubling the "3" upward bend, which is easy to hear him doing in his stellar lead guitar solo for "Love Gun" (KISS) start at approximately 3:33 in the YouTube music video . . . ]

"Come On (Let The Good Times Roll)" (The Jimi Hendrix Experience) -- YouTube music video

"Love Gun" (KISS) -- 1996 Brooklyn Bridge - Reunion Tour/MTV Awards -- YouTube music video

At least initially, it is a totally OCD and ADHD activity, but it works, since for the most part when someone has stellar hand and finger dexterity, as well as an intrinsically immaculate sense of rhythm, the only significant hurdle in learning how to play lead guitar is getting past the speed bumps, which primarily is a matter of powering through (a) the tendency to be lazy, (b) hand and finger pain, and (c) the reluctance to do the same thing over and over and over and over and over . . .

And it is not so much a matter of anything being particularly difficult conceptually, because what really is happening is a combination of (a) creating and programming neural pathways and (b) developing hand and finger strength, as well as doing a bit of fingertip numbing, because most of the standard phrases are just combinations and permutations of "3-1-4" with string bends and an occasional "2" for the odd phrases that span the high-pitch "G" and "b" strings when "4" is "1" and "6" is "3", which for reference is the light gray "Y" in the following diagram of every Rock and Roll and Rhythm and Blues lead guitar solo in the known universe, which is fabulous . . .

[NOTE: The entity or Gestalt aspect is very important, since when the number of notes per second exceeds a certain threshold (a) it is impossible to consider them individually in any immediately conscious way and (b) the only practical way to consider them is as a set, which when promoted to the level of an entity or Gestalt essentially transforms them into a complex texture, which is not played but instead is delivered . . . ]


"hY2" Lead Guitar Pattern

Fabulous!

The larger the ensemble you are writing for, the more this will happen. To get around this (without 20 pages of explanation; you're welcome ) make sure to place your cursor (yellow highlight) on the first beat (or pickup note) manually as opposed to hitting the rewind button all the way back to the beginning. Also, this happens if you try to play a file with lots of staves immediately after it is opened (probably because the samples are still loading).

-t